[coasterville]

Greetings, first time poster here.

I recently acquired a "Members of the UN" countertop flag set. Its a display that measures about 111 long by 6" deep and contains 4"x6" miniatures of all 192 UN member nation's flags, each mounted on a 10" staff.

Well, my question is this, I did not get this set directly from a factory or dealer and no instructions were packed with it regarding which order I should set it up.

Right now I have it setup with the US Flag to the far left (the flags own right), then have filled in the other 192 nations (I added Vatican (Holy See) to the set) in alphabetical order. Another theory is that since it is meant to be a miniature replica of the avenue of flags at the UN, the UN follows a slightly different flag code with all nations in alpha order with no nation given precedence. It also gets tricky in that the collection is arched in the middle, so the "place of honor" isn't the highest point, but the staffs are so close together the highest point isn't exactly very prominent. (I won't further confuse the issue by mentionin that I don't have 11' all in one row, instead it is in two rows).

For reference here is a photo of it:


(Which comes from my blog post about it: http://coasterville.blogspot.com/200...world-set.html )

[american_flag_uk]

Hello there Coasterville!

a very warm welcome to USA flag site!!


i have just read your blog - how great it is that your pleased about getting this flag set! - i have seen one before in a flag shop in the USA - and i wanted it too... i will be sure to get one one day!

nice pics!

ill answer your question first...
i think the way you have them is good! - the US flag on the left and the rest in alphabetical order...

i think you have made up for the arched section being higher by placing the others infront of them! - but this has created a great display!!

when i saw that one in the shop - it too had an arched section in the middle - it was up near the ceiling so it was all spread in one row - and i noticed they were in alphabetical order with the US flag on its own right.

its really a bargain is the price you paid! and you got the new Iraq flag too.. thats good that it is nicely up to date!


i would like to know some more about you and your interest in flags - and maybe some pics of your US flag/s??

[coasterville]

Thanks for the welcome. I'll take my intro over to the Introductions forum.

[Peter Ansoff]

Hi, Coasterville -- glad that you found us!

There was an article in the NAVA journal, "Raven", back in 2001 about the flag display at the UN. Below is what it had to say about the order of the flags. The comments in brackets are my insertions:

"The flags at the United Nations headquarters are arranged following the English alphabet and the UN Official Terminology Code, which uses the short form of the full official name of the country [for example, the "United Mexican States" is "Mexico" in the short form]. An exception is made when a country asks to be listed differently, as the case of Ivory Coast which requested listing under its official name (under "C" for Cote d'Ivoire), or Tanzania (listed as the United Republic of Tanzania under "U").

"The article used with the name of the country is omitted [e.g, the United States is under "U" not "T".] However, El Salvador is listed under "E" because the Spanish article (written with a capital "E") forms an integral part of that country's official name. And in the current dispute over the name of Macedonia, its flag is hoisted under "T" for The Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, in a clear breach of logic and common sense only possible in the world of diplomacy."

The US flag is *not* displayed first at the UN -- it is in its normal alphabetic place among the member nations. The Vatican flag is not either, of course, because the Vatican is not a member of the UN. There is actually a bit of a puzzle over where the Vatican flag should be placed in an alphabetical display of national flags. The problem is that there are actually two distinct entities: the Holy See, which is the institution of the Papacy, and the Vatican City, which is the physical territory. Each one has its own flag. The one that is normally displayed as the "Papal Flag" is the Holy See flag, which really should be under "H."

Best regards,

Peter Ansoff

[coasterville]

Peter,

Thanks for the response, I love that line "in a clear breach of logic and common sense only possible in the world of diplomacy", I'll have to tuck that one away for later use. I hadn't given much though about the differnce between the short form of a nations name, and the full form. I mean in common everyday usage how often do you hear United Mexican States?

What I used as an order reference is a catalog I have from the flag shop located about .5 miles from my houe. The store is an Annin dealer offering a full range of products. In the Annin catalog (which is then branded with the store's name instead of Annin's) they have a section on International Flags and they have it grouped "Members of the United Nations" and then "Other Nations" With the exception of giving the Unted States flag its proper respect in the position of honor, I used the same order as the catalog. (And one of these days I know I am going to give in and walk out of there with a 3'x5' Bennington flag, I particularly like that design) I think the catalog has them in order by the Engligh language version of the short form. That order works for me as I am quickly able to find one in the set if I need make reference of it. I already know two teachers who are friends of the family who want to borrow parts of the set.

As you alluded to, when I went to said flag store to obtain a miniature Papal flag, I went to the endcap that had "Desktop flags of the world" and found out I had to go to the display that had "Miscellanous Desktop Flags". I was thinking, "I know its a county becuase I have actually been there" Though interestingly we did pass an embassy or two on the trip and the big signs out there were phrased similar to "Phillipines Embassy to the Holy See", first time I had heard it called that.

american_flag_uk:

Thanks to you too! Per your request I posted some photos of my US and other flags in the introductions forum. I hope you enjoyed them. I'm not quite up to 61 yet , which is quite a collection by any means. I just counted mine up though and I think I have 16. 3-3x5' with sewn stripes, embroidered stars, none with fringe (2 Nyl-Glo, and the third a Nylon (but not Nyl-Glo) those are used as my main flag outdoors and one here in the home office, then 4 3x5' printed flags though truth be told most of those have faded and I really need to take them up to the flag shop I mentioned above and put them in the Boy Scouts drop box. (Note, I have a low tolerance for fading, so what I consider faded out, others...)

Then there is my Dad's funeral flag (memorial size, cotton, Valley Forge Co.)

Then going to desktop flags, I have one in the world flag set, one on an Uncle Sam statue, one on a 9/11 memorial statue (that one is mounted on what looks to be a halyard on a flagstaff in the scene depicted), and three just sitting around, though one of thoe is more like an 8"x12" cotton. One last one at work in my "Flags of our country" set, and since that set contains a set of flags that used to fly over our land, it could be argued I should count the other 9 as well...


I do have to ask though, a while back I saw a You Tube video that showed a woman from the UK who was happily opening up a very large US Flag she had just received. Though I can't seem to find that video anymore, would that be you by chance?

[american_flag_uk]

Hey coasterville!

so good to see another flag collector around here!

I will have to count my flags up again!!
I mainly collect US flags - as they are intersting and they are extremely pretty and beautiful- as well as being the flag of a nation I think alot of!

I think it goes back to december 2001 when I travelled to the USA for the 1st time and saw flags absolutley EVERYWHERE.
I have just recreated that sort of... here... by having loads of US flags!

The last time i counted my US flags i had 104 - but theres been some new additions since then!

I also have some other national flags and other flags
the latest additions to my other flags have been a Malaysian flag i got last week along with 2 small confederate battle flags about a foot long each

I cant wait to get into my new apartment i shouldbe in within the next 2 months.. the n i can properly display my flags!

right now i can count 18 US flags on my wall... mostly small ones and one 5x3 nylon annin flag - that flew over the US capitol

Your so lucky living so close to a flag shop!

I also like the Bennington flag - and I too don't own one just yet... - I'd like a sewn one - to go witjh my sewn 'Betsy Ross' flag and Star Spangled Banner i have.

Regarding the Youtube video you saw.
It IS possable that could have been me.
i did have a video up of me recieving and opening a large US flag from Arizona in 2006
I went crazy in that video - for I had never previously seen a flag so HUGE!!! - Now i have 2 flags of that size in my collection - 10x15ft/ 9x17ft

In my video I was in my parents sitting room with the laptop sat on the sofa. I took the package and opened it.. took me a while to open it I remember cos the sellotape was well placed! - then i took the flag out and I opened the flag out all over the sitting room floor to see its ginormous size.. (no need to point out that I broke the flag code... I was aware.. but I can't se any harm in having a flag on a clean surface!!)

does this sound farmilier?

[coasterville]

Yes, that was the video exactly.

Next time I have some spare time to go past flag shop, I'll see if the Bennington they have (Annin and Co Nyl-Glo) is printed or sewn. I have a feeling you would love a trip to the store, you can look at displays of all the national flags around the world, all the states, various historical US flags, college and pro sport flags, and much more. Along one wall they have a display of all the various US flags they have, meaning different materials, and designs. It's fun watching someone walk in there and just ask to buy an American flag - then they get asked how they intend to use it, what the weather is like in their area, how much they are willing to spend, etc. I have fun walking through there!

The other flag I would like to get for my collection is one from Nepal, not that I have any interest in Nepal I just like he unusual shape of the flag. That is the only non rectangular national flag, and I already have the one non rectangular US state flag. (Which comes from living in the State it represents - Ohio)

My only time in the UK involve 5 hours in Gatwick airport transiting between two flights (Ohio -> Venice, Italy), I'm about to get somewhat close to your part of the world in a couple months, going to see Ireland.

[american_flag_uk]

hi coasterville!

cool that you saws my video! - i removed it after too many people complained about my breaking the flag code

the flag shop sounds great - ive been to 3 myself in the states... it is great that they have a wall of flags - when u go next - think you could take some pics if they will allow it??

do you have any instant messagers so we can continue this conversation?

[coasterville]

Sure I can be reached on

Yahoo Messanger - coasterville
AIM - coastervilledave