Removing stars from retired flags?

[Lake Lady]

I recently became aware that a service organization in my area is providing stars that have been cut from retired American flags to veterans and deployed troops. I’ve been assured that the flags were disassembled with respect before the stars were removed from the blue field. By disassembling the flag it is no longer considered “a flag” when the stars are removed, and therefore this practice is not desecrating a flag. Please advise.

[NAVA1974]

The United States Flag Code says that The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning.

Cutting a flag to pieces is not dignified. And the argument you quoted " By disassembling the flag it is no longer considered “a flag” when the stars are removed, and therefore this practice is not desecrating a flag" is, in my opinion, bogus. Just imagine applying the same logic to a human.

The US flag has been described as a "living thing" and therefore it ought to be treated as such.

[Adam Cappps]

My family has owned a Flag Manufacturing company located in south eastern Virginia since 1960 or so. I was always told, and repeat it to any one who asks that removing the field (blue with the stars on it) from the stripes is a respectful way to dispose of a flag and when they are separated then it is no longer considered a flag and can be disposed of in a trash bin. We always suggest that you throw each different piece of the former flag in a separate container to further respect our nations symbol.

I would venture that cutting the stars from the field could be viewed as a sign of disrespect and would NEVER tell any one that it would be ok. I will have to check the flag code to be certain. but this is what i have always said.

[Robin Hickman]

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Do you want to check the "Flag Code" regarding "proper disposal" of a "worn out" U.S. Flag ???

GOOD !!!

(Scroll down to K.)



United States Code Title 4 Chapter 1 — The Flag

§8. Respect for flag

No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

1. The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property.
2. The flag should never touch anything beneath it, such as the ground, the floor, water, or merchandise.
3. The flag should never be carried flat or horizontally, but always aloft and free.
4. The flag should never be used as wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery. It should never be festooned, drawn back, nor up, in folds, but always allowed to fall free. Bunting of blue, white, and red, always arranged with the blue above, the white in the middle, and the red below, should be used for covering a speaker's desk, draping the front of the platform, and for decoration in general.
5. The flag should never be fastened, displayed, used, or stored in such a manner as to permit it to be easily torn, soiled, or damaged in any way.
6. The flag should never be used as a covering for a ceiling.
7. The flag should never have placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture, or drawing of any nature.
8. The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.
9. The flag should never be used for advertising purposes in any manner whatsoever. It should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions or handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use and discard. Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.
10. No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart.
11. The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning

NO Cutting.
NO Slicing.
NO Dicing.
NO Ripping.
NO Tearing.
NO Separating.
NO Dismembering.
NO Remaindering.
NO Rendering.
NO Scissors.
NO Knives.
NO Razors.
NO Chainsaws.

NO CEREMONIES.

NO DISRESPECTING.



JUST : "The flag, when it is in such condition that it is no longer a fitting emblem for display, should be destroyed in a dignified way, preferably by burning"



Case Closed.



Robin Hickman
Eugene, Oregon, USA
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[Adam Cappps]

First of all, put down the coffee.

Second, i did check and your correct. I am not sure how you could categorize a ceremony as disrespectful.....

The cutting the flag in parts seems to have been started by the boy scouts. And if you pay attention to their entire ceremony you would understand that it is VERY Dignified and can be acceptable under the flag code.

You seem to misunderstand the word "preferably" and you seem to think it means the only way possible. If that were the case it would say YOU MUST BURN THE FLAG THIS IS THE ONLY WAY.

But it doesn't. So again put the coffee down. and read my last quote

I would venture that cutting the stars from the field could be viewed as a sign of disrespect and would NEVER tell any one that it would be ok. I will have to check the flag code to be certain. but this is what i have always said.

[Robin Hickman]

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1. I'm not drinking coffee.

2. I stand by my post. It is in regard to the WHOLE issue, not just your post. It includes removing The Union from the Flag.

3. There are a number of other threads on the subject in these Forums. Apparently, not very many people choose to read them to find the information they're looking for. Which is why we end up having a large number of people asking the same questions over, and over, and over again.


Think I'll go brew myself some coffee...


Robin Hickman
Eugene, Oregon, USA
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[NAVA1974]

Adam and Robin,
The Flag Code contains the only "official" guidance on flag disposal for civilians. It was drafted by the representatives of numerous patriotic organizations in the 1920's and has been modified over time. Flag Code provisions only have the force of law when they are adopted by states, (or imposed on the citizens of the District of Columbia.) However, even when they become state law we see that the Supreme Court takes a dim view on regulating an individual's right to express themselves using the American flag. If the Court upholds a person's right to protest by burning the flag, a symbol that represents their right to conduct such a protest, then variations in the proper means of disposing of a flag would most certainly be acceptable.

That being said, I subscribe to Robin's assertion that to follow the spirit of the Flag Code you should simply burn a worn out flag. I do not favor protracted ceremonies that involve cutting apart the flag before consigning the constituent parts to the flames - it serves no real purpose.

Nick

[csaanv]

Exactly how would you remove a embroidered star without cutting around it? I can't imagine why you would want to spend the time to remove 50 of them.

[NAVA1974]

Exactly how would you remove a embroidered star without cutting around it? I can't imagine why you would want to spend the time to remove 50 of them.

I thought the concept of removing stars from the flag included the portion of the canton that the star was sewn to (or printed on or embroidered on). So what you end up with is 50 pieces of the blue canton, each with one white star.

Nick

[William Notro]

Wow, I never knew how narrow some people can be about this topic. If you applied the same narrow mindedness to the rest of your life how amazing your life would be, NOT. Listen folks the point here is that you must be respectful of the flag and a suggestion is still only a suggestion not a law. Yes, there are organizatiions that remove the stars with a slight blue background around them to be sent to military personnel on active duty. they do this so the person in the military will know they are not forgotten by the folks back here at home. Now that sure isn't being disrespectful but rather giving a new passionate, patriotic, life to a part of a worn and tattered flag that can no longer fly. By the way, time is taken to, in a dignified manner, burn the remains of the flags that have had the stars cut out of them. I am a verteran and would have greatly appreciated recieving a star when I was on active duty. Stop making a big to do over something that is of little importance when compared to the patriotic well being and confort these stars instill in those who are far away and putting it on the line daily so we can have this disscusion.