Flag Stars & Material

Discussion in 'US Flag Specs and Design' started by csaanv, Apr 10, 2010.

  1. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    Since we're on the subject of new flags and their material, here's a pic of two flags that arrived this week. Both were flown over the U.S. Capitol on July 4, 2010, in honor of the 50th Anniversary of the 50-star flag July 4, 1960 to July 4,2010. One is a Valley Forge Perma-Nyl 100% Nylon. The box is marked "Commercial Grade." The other is a cotton flag made by "America's Flag Company." There is no additional identifying information on the box or the flag, except that they are members of the Flag Manufacturers Association of America.

    Both flags have embroidered stars and sewn stripes.

    10July2010 001_mini.jpg

    The nylon is a very dense material, while the cotton is very porous as you can see.
    Nick
     
  2. csaanv

    csaanv Member

    Nick,
    Is the cotton flag rough to the touch and a little stiff? Probably Aninn.

    mike
     
  3. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    Mike,
    Yes, it is a fairly stiff fabric. Like my old socks the flag could probably stand up in the corner by itself.:D

    I would be surprised if the flag were made by Annin as they have very distinct packaging and never fail to place their labels on everything. I doubt that the Senate requires that the flags be supplied without lables as the nylon flag and box have "Valley Forge" all over them.:confused:

    Nick
     
  4. coasterville

    coasterville Member

    I thought I read somewhere that all US flags 3x5 and larger are now required to bear a label telling the country of origin and manufacturer. I believe in response to the glut of imports after 9/11. (Some of whch were of dubious quality) I know I had a few of them because after the suden boom in the flag marker went bust, several stores couldn't give the things away, which meant I was handed a few of them as premium items for charitable donations..

    Then again this may just be one of those urban legend things that I heard.

    It seems strange, since one flag is Valley Forge, you would think they would get all their flags from one supplier.

    Googling "America's Flag Company" leads me to Americasflagcompany.net which after the splash page redirects you to Liberty Flags. They offer cotton flags in both regular and G-Spec. It does say the G-Spec line comes from Valley Forge, however. The regular 3x5 is "Liberty's own"

    Probing the FMAA's website, which also confirms my belief about every flag needing labeled, lists only Valley Forge, Annin, CF Flag and FlagSource as members. What about Eder Flag?

    Anyway, here is what the FMAA has to say about flag labeling:

    If that is true, and you say the cotton flag you were supplied with does not meet that requirement, then it is most interesting the government would use said flag.
     
  5. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    I did say "There is no additional identifying information on the box or the flag, except that they are members of the Flag Manufacturers Association of America."

    I should have been more specific and noted that there was a FMAA label on the cotton flag that reads "Manufacatured By Flag Manufacturers Association of America FMAA Certified Made in U.S.A."

    Nick
     
  6. coasterville

    coasterville Member

    Great, does it have the FMAA seal on the label. I know on Annin's label he outermost blue ring on the FMAA seal reads "Manufactured by Annin & Co." Perhaps your flag has something similar.

    Although the seal on FMAA's own site doesn't have the outermost blue ring, so that may be an Annin addition:
    [FONT=&quot]
    [/FONT]
     
  7. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member


    Yes:
    10July2010.jpg

    The reverse of the label reads " 100% Cotton Made in U.S.A"

    Nick
     
  8. coasterville

    coasterville Member

    Thanks. Well, as I indicated Americas Flag Company's website redirects you to Liberty Flag. But, the FMAA only lists four members, but concedes that you don't have to be a member or get their certification to make flags.

    The four members they list are Annin, Valley Forge, CF Flag, and FlagSource. FlagSource's website is dead, we know that Annin and Valley Forge both use their own distinctive imprints or tags. I did find that CF Flag uses the slogan "America's Flag Company" on their website. (Whereas Annin is "Flagmakers to the World" and Valley Forge is "The Greatest name in flags") I realize you didn't put me on the task of investigating this, so sorry if I am obsessing.

    For those who were asking what the Annin Bulldog material looks like, it looks very similar to the open weave depicted in Nick's photo. (As opposed to the material that Ruffin (we think) used on my Betsy Ross which is a much fuller, plusher, heavier cotton.
     
  9. Robin Hickman

    Robin Hickman Well-Known Member

    .
    Flag Snobbery ? :confused:


    HERE ??? :eek:


    One of the advantages of printed Flags is the wonderful way they look flying in the sunlight. Particularly so when being "backlit" by the sun so that the Stars are as white as the white Stripes are instead of being dark, shadowy pointed "blobs" that embroidered or appliques Stars appear to be.

    Oh, and printed Flags lighter and more suple than their heavier, stiffer embroidered & sewn "cousins" are. Which, of course, means that they "fly" easier and better too!

    Now that I think of it..... I do belive that they are less expensive and more economical too!


    I should know! I have over 500 of them in my house !!! :D


    Robin
     
  10. csaanv

    csaanv Member

    Thanks David! This is good info. Thanks to Nick for the pic too! I hope FlagSource has not gone out of business. They made some good flags. I have a couple of them, a King's Color (1st Union flag w/o St. Patrick's cross) and a Welsh dragon flag. They were all sewn and yet priced around $40! Of course that was a few(?) years ago. Concerning the new Bulldog cotton bunting, I assume that is the new industry standard. Too bad.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2010
  11. Robin Hickman

    Robin Hickman Well-Known Member

    .

    BTW : The CF Flag Company likes to bill itself as "America's Flag Company" (you might even say it's their "motto"), and it IS a member of the FMAA.

    I have 250 of their PRINTED 3'x5' American flags.


    Robin
    .
     
  12. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    And I understand from Jim Ferrigan that CF Co. once stood for Chicago Flag Company. Now I belive they operate out of Alabama so they had to loose the Chicago moniker.

    Nick
     
  13. Robin Hickman

    Robin Hickman Well-Known Member

    .
    Hi, Nick !


    Yes, the "CF" used to stand for "Chicago Flag". I think the reason for the change was to make it less confusing for their customers and potential customers who might easily get confused as to WHY the Chicago Flag Company is based in Huntsville, Alabama !!! :eek:

    CF Flag used to be semi-active on eBay using the member name of "BestFlag". They also had/have a "retail" website whose name is based on the "BestFlag" moniker. I bought Flags from them through their eBay outlet. :D


    Robin
    .
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2010
  14. Robin Hickman

    Robin Hickman Well-Known Member

    .

    It just occurred to me that the difference between the "stiff" and "soft" cotton Flags may be something as simple as the difference between "stiff" and "Soft" Levi's 501 cotton jeans : a couple of washings !!! :D :eek: :D :eek:


    Robin
    .
     
  15. coasterville

    coasterville Member

    As I recall though , Robin you store all the flags for your town. That's a bit different than those of us only buying for a single household. I am flying my main flag From a traditional wall mount bracket next to the front door (to the left of front door when viewed from street. Since any of my guests stand next to my flag as they wait at my door, I want them to see a quality flag in great condition.
     
  16. csaanv

    csaanv Member

    I tried that. I thought by soaking the flag in tepid water that it would "wash out" the siffness but no love.
    Cheers,
    mike
     
  17. My goodness me, how this thread has progressed since I last read it! i ONLY WISH i HADN'T BEEN BUSY OVER THE LAST WEEK OR i WOULD HAVE BUTTED IN SOONER ON THIS ONE!

    LMFAO at FLAG SNOBBERY!!!

    I am not a flag snobberist - much anyway! Since I have enjoyed collecting US flags from all sorts of companies to try and get a good idea of the variations, in materials, construction, star size, and spacing etc

    I must admit I prefer a sewn flag to a printed one, but I see the point about the stars shining up in the sun.. I have a couple of flags with printed stars, and sewn stripes, and they are printed NYLON.

    The ones I dislike most are those printed polyester ones.. often the colors are all wrong and they just fade... But I still have a few of them in my collection!

    I have a couple of old Annin Reliance cotton flags in my collection -both with 50 stars - printed stars and sewn stripes - the cotton is much thinner than what is used on the modern counterparts, and very soft
     
  18. Robin Hickman

    Robin Hickman Well-Known Member

    .

    RE: "Flag Source" : As far as I know, the "Flag Source" website run by J.C. Schultz Enterprises, Inc. (a member of FMAA) is STILL alive and well and can be found at :

    http://www.FlagSource.com/


    Robin Hickman
    Eugene, Oregon, USA
    .
     

Share This Page