medallion 13's dates

Discussion in 'Flag Identification and Collecting' started by brooklynite, Sep 15, 2011.

  1. brooklynite

    brooklynite New Member

    I ran into an interesting situation where I was "guaranteed" that a medallion parade flag was from the centennial. The seller provided the following photo of the original packaging and the 13-star flag. Here are the two images:

    flags.jpg picture by brooklynite74 - Photobucket

    flags.jpg picture by brooklynite74 - Photobucket

    A few days later, I found the set of 50-star flags pictured here:
    flags.jpg picture by brooklynite74 - Photobucket

    The packaging in both the "guaranteed" 1876 flag and the 50-star flags are identical and both read "One dozen No. 1 National Flags". A quick search of ebay sales revealed that at least 3 other sales have sold 13-star flags with this packaging and claimed they were centennial.

    Several questions:
    1. Anyone care to venture a guess on the dates of the 13-star flag?
    2. Could the 13's and 50's both be bicentennial?
    3. Was the medallion pattern with a a central star of the same size as the others known to be printed on small cotton flags during the bicentennial (or centennial for that matter)?
    4. What company produced this packaging and over how long a period could they possibly have used the same packaging?

    Thoughts and comments much appreciated
     
  2. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    1: Early 20th Century
    2: No
    3: No. The "medallion" pattern and 3-2-3-2-3 patterns for 13 star flags, both large and small, were thoroughly replaced by the time of the1926 Sesquicentennial(USA 150 1776-1926) and 1932 George Washington Birthday Bicentennial. In the 1970's the only mass produced 13-star flags were the "Betsy Ross" and the "Bennington" flags. A significant exception was the 48-flag set of historic reproductions made by the Golden State Mfg Co of Hollywood California. That set included a number of 13 star flags, some of which have been sold on eBay as genuine antique flags!!:mad:
    4. Don't know what company used that packaging but I have similar packages of 13 stars, 48 star, and 50-star flags with similar packaging. The flagmakers had no reason to change the method of packaging as it worked well until at least the 1960's. The age of the paper and cruder finishing of the sticks point to early 20th C for the 13 and 48 star flags. This bundle of 48 star flags has paper wraps with different text and appears older than the ones you pictured.
    Dozenflags1.jpg

    Nick A
    Columbia MD
     
  3. brooklynite

    brooklynite New Member

    Thanks NAVA74, if I can extrapolate from your response, the implication is that the exact same packaging, same text, same font was used from c. 1920's (13-star) to c. 1970's (50-star). I'm curious if you are aware of any 48-star flags with the same packaging as the photos I shared ("One dozen No. 1 National Flags"). That would lend credibility to the idea that this packaging was used over a period spanning early to mid-late 20th century.
     
  4. brooklynite

    brooklynite New Member

    ...and more importantly support the early 20th century date you suggested for the 13-star flag in my original post
     
  5. NAVA1974

    NAVA1974 Active Member

    Here is a pic of some larger 48's with similar packaging from the 1940' or 1950's

    Dozen48s1.jpg

    Nick A
    Columbia MD
     
  6. AmericaHurrah

    AmericaHurrah Member

    Ditto on everything that Nick just said. He is spot-on.
     
  7. AmericaHurrah

    AmericaHurrah Member

    I date these Span-Am War - Sesquecentennial as a general rule. Production could have persisted after 1926, but as of what I know right now, I'd guess not. Some could likewise be earlier than 1898, but once again, I'd guess not.
     
  8. AmericaHurrah

    AmericaHurrah Member

    p.s.: Some of these are printed on an oilcloth-type cotton in the same exact size and pattern. Production of those probably occurred during the same exact time frame, but could have persisted longer.
     

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