When to put your hand over your heart...?

[Peter Ansoff]

Greetings, jkgeary! Welcome to the forum.

This topic has been discussed in some detail here, and it's actually just a bit more complicated than that. See this thread:

Veterans' Salute protocols

Especially the series posted on 8/31/09.

Best,

Peter Ansoff

[jmesr15]

I received your answer and it pertained to military. My question; is it protocol for the general public to show respect to the flag when it passes or during the National Anthem by placing their hand over their heart?

[Robin Hickman]

.

Simple answer : Yes.

Not so simple answer : RE-read this entire thread (including entry #9 written to you from me over a month ago) and/or the pretaining portions of the U.S. Code that deal with such matters.

http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/flagcode.htm


Robin Hickman
Eugene, Oregon, USA
.

[Scout]

I know service men and women salute when in uniform, former Marine myself.

But how does it affect members of the Boy Scouts? The way I understand it a uniformed scout salutes the flag.

Also as I understand it, everyone should stand hand over heart or a salute when that flag is moving with the anthem or not. i.e. parade

In the Marines it was face the direction of the music and salute if you couldn't see the flag.

As for hats it goes, hat over left shoulder hand over heart. I think someone had posted that already.

But flag visible or not, should one salute for the anthem?

This is a great forum, awesome to have all this info. Thank you for any replies.

[shrubber]

Boy Scout Assistant Scoutmaster here.
The BSA Class A uniform is considered a recognized and official uniform by the US.
Therefore, Boy Scouts, in full uniform are allowed to and required to salute the flag ( using the Boy Scout salute )
Girl Scouts, however, do not have a recognized and official uniform according to the govenment, and may not and should not salute. They may however, give the Girl Scout sign during the Pledge and the like, rather than hand over the heart.

[shrubber]

just noticed the other part of your question.
If the flag is not visible, during the anthem, you, depending on your uniform, either salute or place your hand over your heart, and face the direction that the music is coming from.

[Peter Ansoff]

The BSA Class A uniform is considered a recognized and official uniform by the US.

Well, not exactly. Title 10 of the US code states that it's illegal for persons who are not on active duty in the military to wear military uniforms or parts of uniforms. The law contains a list of exclusions to the ban, saying that Reservists, members of the National Guard, veterans, actors portraying military personnel, etc., can wear military uniforms on appropriate occasions. The same law says that "A person in any of the following categories may wear the uniform prescribed for that category", and lists "Members of the Boy Scouts of America" as one of the categories. The reason for this provision was that the early Boy Scout uniform was very similar to US Army uniforms; the exception made it clear that Boy Scouts were allowed to wear such uniforms. This doesn't make the BSA uniform any more "official" than other organizations' uniforms; it just says that it's legal to wear it. This issue never arose with Girl Scout uniforms, because they don't resemble US military uniforms.

Therefore, Boy Scouts, in full uniform are allowed to and required to salute the flag ( using the Boy Scout salute ). Girl Scouts, however, do not have a recognized and official uniform according to the govenment, and may not and should not salute.

This is not true, at least not according to the Flag Code. The Flag Code says that persons "in uniform" render the military salute, and was recently modified to allow military personnel and veterans to do so when not in uniform. The "in uniform" reference was clearly intended to apply to the military, but civilian uniform-wearing organizations (police forces, for example) often follow the same protocol. The Flag Code does not give the Boy Scouts any special status in this respect. Of course, the Boy Scouts (and the Girl Scouts as well!) are free to make their own regulations. The "Flag Ceremonies" page of the official Girl Scouts web site specifies that their color guard salutes the flag.

Peter Ansoff

[shrubber]

The BSA Class A uniform is considered a recognized and official uniform by the US.

Well, not exactly. Title 10 of the US code states that it's illegal for persons who are not on active duty in the military to wear military uniforms or parts of uniforms. The law contains a list of exclusions to the ban, saying that Reservists, members of the National Guard, veterans, actors portraying military personnel, etc., can wear military uniforms on appropriate occasions. The same law says that "A person in any of the following categories may wear the uniform prescribed for that category", and lists "Members of the Boy Scouts of America" as one of the categories. The reason for this provision was that the early Boy Scout uniform was very similar to US Army uniforms; the exception made it clear that Boy Scouts were allowed to wear such uniforms. This doesn't make the BSA uniform any more "official" than other organizations' uniforms; it just says that it's legal to wear it. This issue never arose with Girl Scout uniforms, because they don't resemble US military uniforms.

Therefore, Boy Scouts, in full uniform are allowed to and required to salute the flag ( using the Boy Scout salute ). Girl Scouts, however, do not have a recognized and official uniform according to the govenment, and may not and should not salute.

This is not true, at least not according to the Flag Code. The Flag Code says that persons "in uniform" render the military salute, and was recently modified to allow military personnel and veterans to do so when not in uniform. The "in uniform" reference was clearly intended to apply to the military, but civilian uniform-wearing organizations (police forces, for example) often follow the same protocol. The Flag Code does not give the Boy Scouts any special status in this respect. Of course, the Boy Scouts (and the Girl Scouts as well!) are free to make their own regulations. The "Flag Ceremonies" page of the official Girl Scouts web site specifies that their color guard salutes the flag.

Peter Ansoff

I'm not sure what the point of disagreement is?
Either you are 'In uniform' or you are not.
Girl Scouts do not have a recognized uniform. Boy Scouts do.

[NAVA1974]

"I'm not sure what the point of disagreement is?
Either you are 'In uniform' or you are not."

Employees at McDonald's restaurants wear uniforms.

Try applying the flag code to that.

[shrubber]

"I'm not sure what the point of disagreement is?
Either you are 'In uniform' or you are not."

Employees at McDonald's restaurants wear uniforms.

Try applying the flag code to that.

Well, when the US code includes McDonalds uniforms as "Uniforms" then by all means they can salute.
Until then, uniforms are limited to whatever the United States Code says.
Specifically, 10 USC, Subtitle A, Part II, Chapter 45, Sections v771 v772.